Progressive Indiana Network: https://progressiveindiana.net
HoosLeft: https://hoosleft.us
Ben Davis: https://www.bendavisforindiana.com/
Joshua Brant: https://electjoshuabrant.org/
Harrison Jacobo: https://socialistpartyin.com/
SUMMARY:
For the week ending in Independence Day, the same week in which independent candidates must submit signatures to qualify for November’s ballot, Scott sits down with three Indiana candidates running entirely outside the two-party system: Ben Davis, democratic socialist running for Statehouse District 13 under the Socialist Party of Indiana banner; Joshua Brant, independent candidate for State Senate District 23; and Harrison Jacobo, Secretary of State candidate for the Socialist Party of Indiana who is not making the ballot this cycle. The conversation is grounded in the concrete experience of doing something the system is designed to make nearly impossible: getting on the ballot as an independent in Indiana. From signature thresholds and verification rates to county party cold shoulders and constitutional barriers, the guests document the structural gauntlet that filters out working-class and insurgent candidates before a single vote is cast. Framed against Scott’s opening on the Zohran Mamdani-endorsed sweep in New York’s congressional primaries and Jaime Harrison’s backlash quote, the episode argues that the left is told it can’t win inside the two-party system and can’t run outside it either — and that the only way forward is to elect independents who will dismantle the rules that protect the duopoly.
WHAT’S INSIDE:
00:00:21 Introduction: Mamdani, Jaime Harrison, AOC, and the Case for Independents
- Scott opens with Zohran Mamdani’s endorsed Democratic Socialist sweep in New York congressional primaries, which triggered backlash from Hakeem Jeffries, James Carville, and former DNC Chair Jaime Harrison -- the last of whom told progressives not to use the party’s resources if they hate the party.
- Scott’s counter: when progressives go outside and draw votes, they get accused of playing spoiler. You can’t have it both ways.
- AOC’s 2020 observation frames the structural argument: the U.S. two-party umbrella compresses an entire spectrum into two labels. Last week’s guest Metin Pekin proposed a no-party system; another path is electing independents who will revoke the two parties’ special legal privileges.
00:02:44 Support the Show
- HoosLeft and Progressive Indiana Network don’t paywall content or charge candidates -- support at progressiveindiana.net ($5/month or $50/year) keeps it going.
- Social handles: @hoosleft.us on Bluesky, Instagram, and Threads; @HoosLeft on Facebook, TikTok, and YouTube; PIN is @PINIndiana on Bluesky and TikTok.
00:04:00 Welcome and Framing: Ballard’s 74,000 Signatures and the Ballot Access Challenge
- Scott introduces the three guests -- Ben Davis (HD-13, SPI), Joshua Brant (SD-23, independent), Harrison Jacobo (Secretary of State, SPI) -- and uses Greg Ballard’s 74,000-signature haul as a benchmark.
- Ballard turned in double the required statewide threshold because a large share will be thrown out during verification -- standard practice, but easier when you have the resources to do so.
- Scott notes the disparity in resources: Ballard had financial backing including support from former Governor Mitch Daniels. Tonight’s guests did not.
00:06:15 Ben Davis: 384 Signatures, 650 Gathered, 63% Verification Rate
- Ben’s threshold for HD-13 was 384 verified signatures. His team of over 30 volunteers -- including Harrison Jacobo -- knocked roughly 2,500 doors over six months and collected 650 raw signatures, coming in at 428 verified.
- The 63% verification rate reflects two main failure modes: people who weren’t registered to vote at all, and people registered at a different address than where Ben knocked in District 13.
- Ben was aiming for a modest buffer above the threshold in case the state office “decided to do anything funny.”
00:08:34 Joshua Brant: Going It Alone, Coming Up Short in May
- Joshua had no volunteer network to draw on as a first-time independent candidate -- he knocked doors primarily alone, walking miles over months.
- He had planned on a 30% buffer but discovered at the end of May he was still about 200 signatures short of his target, requiring an intensive push in June to reach his number with any cushion.
- His county put his threshold at 628; his own initial calculation was partially inaudible but in that range.
00:10:07 Harrison Jacobo: 37,000 Needed and Why He Won’t Make It
- A group came from Seattle, excited about the Socialist Party of Indiana forming, and collected around 400-500 signatures over four or five days -- but those came from across 20 different counties, creating logistical problems for county-by-county submission without funding or infrastructure.
- Today -- June 30th -- is the final submission day. Harrison is not making the threshold. Scott asked if signatures needed to come from all parts of the state -- Harrison isn’t certain it’s a constitutional mandate, and Joshua confirms the signatures themselves don’t need to come from a varied geography.
00:13:29 The Lincoln Party, the SPI, and What Ballot Lines Actually Mean
- Greg Ballard is running not just as an independent but under the Lincoln Party banner. If he earns enough votes in November, the Lincoln Party gains official ballot access for four years.
- Ben explains the petition form mechanics: candidates check either “independent, no party” or “independent with party.” His ballot will say Socialist Party of Indiana; Ballard’s will say Lincoln Party -- but neither party currently has official minor party status.
- The SPI’s path to recognition requires 2% of the prior election in signatures to get on the ballot, then 2% of the general election vote to secure the ballot line for four years. With Harrison not on the ballot, that clock resets. The SPI will continue running candidates as independents until another statewide shot.
00:17:38 Joshua Brant’s Origin Story: Why He’s Running as an Independent
- Joshua traces a political evolution: proudly liberal in his 20s, more centrist in his 30s, and then -- as a veteran with kids -- arriving at the conclusion that centrism is also sometimes wrong. There are clear rights and wrongs, and staying in the middle isn’t always a virtue.
- His motivation: he doesn’t want his kids or anyone else’s kids to inherit the political mess being created if nobody does something about it.
- His ballot line will simply say “independent.”
00:20:17 Harrison’s Plans Without a Ballot Line: Building the SPI
- Harrison is not a fan of Beau Bayh or Greg Ballard; Scott adds that he’s presumably not a fan of Republican Max Engling either. Harrison confirms.
- His focus now shifts entirely to building SPI party infrastructure -- applying what was learned from this cycle to develop a stronger organizational base for future candidates.
- The goal is to gain a genuine foothold for the longer-term project of breaking the two-party system.
00:21:53 What Voters Said at the Door: Blythe Potter, Bargersville, and Bipartisan Excitement
- Harrison’s canvassing experience was more mixed than expected in terms of immediate excitement for the SPI specifically -- but he was surprised by how many Democrats responded positively to the competition argument.
- Some voters said they were holding out for Blythe Potter; Harrison’s message was that signing his petition doesn’t affect their November vote.
- Harrison had already spoken with Potter directly -- she lives down the road from him in Bargersville. Democrats who signed his petition, including some previously elected ones, said simply: competition is good.
00:23:30 Ben Davis: The Three-Way Race in HD-13 and the Spoiler Question
- Since Scott and Ben last spoke in January, a Democrat has entered the HD-13 race, making it a three-way contest. Ben has not faced significant spoiler pressure -- most local Democrats disagree with the Tippecanoe County Democratic chair’s decision to deny him a party endorsement because he’s a democratic socialist.
- The chair’s reasoning: “we don’t want a Democratic Socialist on our ticket.”
- Ben is running a full campaign, not a paper candidacy. The 2024 paper candidate got 26% just by existing. Ben is planning win numbers as if it were a two-way race and wants to demonstrate that an independent democratic socialist can win in the heartland.
00:27:11 Joshua Brant: SD-23, Spencer Deery, and the Copenhaver Dilemma
- Scott notes that Dr. David Sanders -- a previous guest -- is the Democrat in Joshua’s SD-23 race, and that the Republican barely survived his primary by only three votes: incumbent Spencer Deery over far-right challenger Paula Copenhaver.
- Joshua admits he was genuinely torn -- Copenhaver might have been easier to beat, but maybe not better for Indiana. He settled on wanting Spencer to win the primary, but now that he has, it’s time for someone else to take over.
- Scott draws the broader lesson: boosting the opponent you think is easier to beat can backfire -- he cites Hillary Clinton and Trump in 2016 as the cautionary tale.
00:30:12 Harrison Jacobo: The Indiana Constitution and Why It Has to Be Amended
- Harrison identifies the core structural problem: Indiana’s constitution explicitly enshrines a two-major-party system, defining support as going to the parties with the most and second-most votes. Minor parties receive no state resources.
- Fixing this requires amending the constitution to eliminate the “two major parties” distinction -- making all parties simply “parties.” Statutory workarounds are possible but legally vulnerable.
- He notes the constitution isn’t always followed anyway -- public education is constitutionally mandated and chronically underfunded -- but constitutional language is the right long-term target.
00:32:18 Ben Davis: Paper Signatures, Electronic Access, and the Process Reform Case
- Ben holds up his six months of paper signatures to illustrate the physical reality: all of it door-to-door, ink on paper, no electronic or mail-in option -- a process that consumed all three guests’ lives.
- For context: major party candidates get on the ballot either by voting in the last two primaries (a few minutes per election) or by getting a letter from their county chair. Independents run a six-month campaign just to get to the starting line.
- His near-term legislative ask: allow electronic signatures. He also agrees with Harrison that a constitutional amendment is ultimately necessary.
00:34:37 Joshua Brant: Two Parties Won’t Dismantle Themselves -- and Candidacy as a Fundamental Right
- Joshua argues that before the Republican Party existed, the only barriers to candidacy were constitutional ones. Every time third parties or independents have risen in popularity, the major parties have added new statutory barriers -- something he thinks is unconstitutional, though he’s not a lawyer.
- Scott frames it as collusion -- a form of corruption -- which is the centerpiece of Joshua’s campaign platform.
- Joshua’s anti-corruption proposal addresses this directly: he wants candidacy recognized as a fundamental right. Every individual component of running for office is already a fundamental right, but the act of being a candidate is not. He finds that gap staggering.
00:36:44 Harrison Jacobo: 45% Are Independents, But Even Progressives Get Shut Out
- About 45% of Americans identify as independent -- more than either major party. But the structural capture runs deep: the Democratic Party couldn’t even tolerate Dr. Valerie McCray’s 2024 U.S. congressional campaign on its own ticket because she hadn’t gone through the approved nomination process.
- Harrison was on that campaign and saw firsthand not just lack of support but active condemnation from within the party.
- If progressives can’t run inside the Democratic Party without being attacked, the party is never going to help build a broader alternative.
00:38:36 Ben Davis: Independence Day Press Event at the Stargate
- Ben announces a press event Thursday at 10 a.m. at the Stargate -- the sculpture between the Indiana Statehouse and the Indiana Government Center -- timed to coincide with the final signature submission day and the Fourth of July weekend.
- The goal: draw attention to the structural barriers independents face and make clear these aren’t hobbyist campaigns -- they represent months of serious organizing.
- Joshua and Harrison will both be there.
00:40:06 Scott: Sean Steele, the Democratic Brand Problem, and Rural Indiana
- Scott flags another independent to watch: Sean Steele, running in House District 75 in Lawrence County, where there appears to be no Democratic challenger. He’s confirmed Steele for the show on July 28th.
- The experiment: can an independent run against a Republican incumbent in rural Indiana without the Democratic Party label working against him?
00:42:08 Joshua Brant: Refusing to Be Labeled Left or Right
- Joshua consistently refuses to let voters pre-sort him. His answer: take each issue individually, weigh both sides, form your own conclusion about what I am. He doesn’t want to be tied to a label someone else has already defined.
00:42:58 Ben Davis: The Socialist Label at the Door -- Fewer Reactions Than You’d Expect
- Ben introduces himself as an independent socialist candidate -- not a Republican or Democrat -- and is consistently surprised by how few people react to it.
- What actually resonates is the independence itself: people say they want more options. That sentiment, not ideological alignment, is the common thread Ben hears from the roughly 45% of Hoosiers who identify as independents.
00:44:17 Harrison Jacobo: The Socialist Label and Staying on Policy
- Harrison’s strategy with the socialist label: don’t over-explain, don’t apologize, stand firm and redirect to policy. If people try to denigrate the label, the counter is: what are you actually doing for your community?
- He notes the demagoguery around socialism -- including the bad-faith attempt to tie it to Nazism because the word appears in the party name -- but says the label has less power than it used to.
- Best approach: avoid getting into label debates and focus on the actual issues.
00:47:09 Harrison Jacobo: The Golden Rule, Identity Politics, and LGBTQ+ Rights
- Scott raises the accusation leveled at independents who don’t support Democrats: that they’re sacrificing people of color and the LGBTQ community.
- Harrison’s response is grounded in the golden rule -- treat others as you’d want to be treated. He supports trans friends in their journeys because that’s how he’d want to be treated. The principle doesn’t require a party affiliation.
- Scott adds the small-government framing: letting people determine these things for themselves and keeping government out of it is, by definition, a conservative position.
00:49:19 Joshua Brant: Tax Restructuring and Reinvestment in Indiana
- Scott presents the standard accusation against socialists: big government, high taxes. Joshua’s response: the Republican restructuring plan proves that lowering taxes at all costs isn’t good governance -- Hoosiers want efficiency, doing as much as possible with as little as possible.
- His reciprocal tax plan removes rewards from corporations extracting profit from Hoosiers and shipping it elsewhere, and instead incentivizes reinvestment back into Indiana.
00:51:13 Ben Davis: Indiana’s Flat Tax and Starting From Scratch
- Senate Enrolled Act 1 for 2025 is pulling millions from schools while delivering minimal property tax relief to middle-income homeowners and actively hurting owners of lower-cost homes.
- Indiana’s flat income tax -- one of the lowest rates in the country -- disproportionately benefits the wealthy, who keep a larger absolute amount, while hitting lower-income Hoosiers harder in relative terms.
- Ben’s position: no part of Indiana’s tax structure should be held sacred. Start from first principles -- food, clothing, shelter, education, health care -- and build backward from what every Hoosier needs to survive.
00:53:22 Harrison Jacobo: One SOS Commitment -- Corruption, Contracts, and Voter Information
- Scott asks what Harrison wants to see from the next Secretary of State. Harrison focuses on two things: transparency and accountability in how business contracts are awarded (particularly affecting small businesses), and active voter education so people know who is actually on the ballot.
- A less-informed electorate, Harrison argues, is a feature rather than a bug of the current system -- it keeps people voting for whoever they’d want to get a beer with rather than on the merits.
- Scott adds: straight-party-ticket voting in Indiana is a structural obstacle to independents that compounds the problem.
00:55:04 Joshua Brant: Insanity Is Doing the Same Thing and Expecting Different Results
- Joshua’s closing thought: doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results is the definition of insanity -- often attributed to Einstein. Another wise man might say that’s also the definition of practice. But practice implies improvement, and Indiana’s political system hasn’t shown much of that.
00:55:59 Ben Davis: Unsung Heroes -- County Election Staff and the Case for Electronic Signatures
- Ben closes by thanking county election staff, who have to individually verify every independent candidate signature against voter rolls -- one staffer told him it’s the single most tedious task in her entire job.
- His second point: if the rules were changed to allow electronic signatures, it would reduce the burden on candidates and clerks alike, making the democratic infrastructure work better for everyone.
00:57:47 Closing and How to Find Each Candidate
Ben Davis: https://www.bendavisforindiana.com/
Joshua Brant: https://electjoshuabrant.org/
Harrison Jacobo: https://socialistpartyin.com/
